Let docks have territory
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Authored by temple on Dec 21 2017, 2:53 AM.

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scythetwirler
elexis

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(Owns No Changed Paths)

Summary

It might be interesting to let docks have territory.

Superdocks already do, and it's kind of weird that regular docks don't since they're an integral part of your town. Outposts are meant to be isolated and away from your town, so it makes sense that they don't have territory.

A problem with island maps is you need space to build a civic center, and often there's not a lot of room. If docks had territory then you could build houses or towers or a barracks to get started in an area.

It would be helpful for invading on water maps, getting a foothold on your opponent's land. And yet if they capture or destroy your dock then the other buildings will be disconnected from a root territory and start blinking and decaying. Or they could deny you space to build the dock by having a civic center close enough that its territory influence covers the shoreline.

I'm not sure if it actually works, but perhaps on nomad maps players could try a dock + barracks + houses rather than a cc. Maybe "no cc" could be a variant that players agree to (like "no cav" games).

If docks are built too far into the water then the territory might not extend to the shore, which is what happened to the green player here.

Test Plan

Thoughts?

Diff Detail

Repository

rP 0 A.D. Public Repository

Branch

/ps/trunk

Lint

Lint OK

Unit

No Unit Test Coverage

Build Status

Buildable 4151
Build 7300: Vulcan Build	Jenkins
Build 7299: arc lint + arc unit

Event Timeline

temple created this revision.Dec 21 2017, 2:53 AM

lmao

Successful build - Chance fights ever on the side of the prudent.

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Harbormaster completed remote builds in B4151: Diff 4833.Dec 21 2017, 3:27 AM

Purely conceptually I rather like this. You might want to open a thread in the forums though.

Indeed a big gamechanger, especially docks giving not only territory but root territory. Not sure this is the right choice.
Root territory is meant for special buildings that can be the center of a city.

(Besides the effect that one can spam root territory giving buildings then.)

ffffffff awarded a token.Dec 21 2017, 12:48 PM

ffffffff rescinded a token.

ffffffff awarded a token.

In D1164#46554, @elexis wrote:

Indeed a big gamechanger, especially docks giving not only territory but root territory. Not sure this is the right choice.
Root territory is meant for special buildings that can be the center of a city.

It has to be root territory, otherwise the area would blink and you couldn't build there.

(Besides the effect that one can spam root territory giving buildings then.)

Right, then we could add a build restriction to docks so they can't be built near each other.

I agree with elexis, that would be quite a huge change, and i'm not convinced it would be for the good. I've the impression that this would make dock quite op for their small price, so you would also have to increase their cost, but then you loose the current interest of docks.
In addition, you compare to super_dock, but super_dock was intended as a special structure for carthage with specific abilities. My feeling is that, if we were to add shipyards to other civs (as is done in delenda), we would not give them the root territory to keep its unique specificity to the cart super_dock.
And another point, this patch would not be complete as the ai is unable to adapt to it. Its way to position docks would have to be changed as currently it only tries to build docks in islands in which it has a cc.
But as said in other comments, maybe discuss that in the forums to have other opinions.

Root territory is intended for city-defining structures, it's the main concept of the game.
If you have a really strong opinion on this, convince someone who can convince mimo and me.
Otherwise abandon.

This revision now requires changes to proceed.Dec 27 2017, 2:41 PM

I still think it's worth considering, but can be reclaimed later, so fine.

Noooooooooooo,
root territory should only be preserved for city-defining buildings, not some place that smells like fish.
Who cares about a CC anymore if you can just have a dock, or 20 docks.
It also would allow one to place a dock at random places and start building a city or fortification there.
It for the most part defeats the purpose of territory.

Lionkanzen added a subscriber: Lionkanzen.Mar 22 2018, 6:51 AM

elexis mentioned this in D1762: [gameplay] give Fortress a territory root.Jan 24 2019, 6:06 PM

elexis mentioned this in D2507: [gameplay] allow building palisades in neutral territory.Jun 7 2020, 6:31 PM