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[gameplay] Decrease metal cost for mercenaries
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Authored by borg- on Mar 11 2021, 11:57 PM.

Details

Reviewers
wraitii
Group Reviewers
Balancing
Summary

This patch is a follow-up to D3269/rP24635 and an alternative to D3699.

A constant complaint from some players. The cost is lower compared to the a23, however the metal cost is very high which makes it difficult to train a reasonable amount to make the desired effect which is to surprise the opponent in quantity and quality. In this case, metal is being used for champions or researching new technologies, and mercenaries are being left out. I made a lot of games trying a strategy where mercenaries could be useful and it really is very difficult, there is usually a lot of food and metal is missing. It is not possible to surprise the opponent with quality and quantity. Mercenaries are only good if you have a lot of metal in an emergency.

Well, my proposal will be divided into two patches.

This patch changes the food value of mercenaries to -20% compared to citizen soldiers and changes the cost of wood to metal. Therefore, mercenaries cost more now than in a24, but they have a lower value in metal.

The purpose of the second patch is to get mercenaries to train in advanced rank instead of basic rank. The intention is that it is possible to surprise the opponent in quality and not just quantity.

It also makes historical sense since mercenaries were "professionals".

Rank upgrade technology is now for elite rank and only for carthage. Bringing a differentiation to this civilization

Test Plan

test whether it is possible to train mercenaries constantly.

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Event Timeline

borg- created this revision.Mar 11 2021, 11:57 PM
borg- requested review of this revision.Mar 11 2021, 11:57 PM
borg- edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)Mar 11 2021, 11:59 PM

Could you please link to the forum thread where this is discussed?

Could you please link to the forum thread where this is discussed?

There are many topics in the forum with gameplay discussions, are not topics especially for this, it is something adding during the conversation, it is difficult to find. In addition, some are talked in the lobby, etc..

I think I agree with this overall, but I'm wary that other changes (tech reductions, CC cost reduction?) might affect it.
Likewise, a more balanced map design would reduce the problem somewhat IMO.

borg- added a comment.Mar 16 2021, 4:35 PM

I think I agree with this overall, but I'm wary that other changes (tech reductions, CC cost reduction?) might affect it.
Likewise, a more balanced map design would reduce the problem somewhat IMO.

Even if we have cheaper techs or CC, it wouldn't make much of a difference, I think.

Currently for you to train 10 horses you need 800 metal, which is a lot. The metal value proposed by the patch is still high, but I'm taking into account that they would start with rank 2, so it looks good.

The current situation is certainly not great and while this patch softens it, it's not really a long-term solution. Mercenaries basically stay “citizens that cost metal”. More important is what mercenaries must be in 0 A.D.; perhaps their templates should get fully separated, as is the case with champions.
(Also keep in mind mercenaries are not supposed to be cost effective.)

borg- added a comment.Mar 16 2021, 5:05 PM

The current situation is certainly not great and while this patch softens it, it's not really a long-term solution. Mercenaries basically stay “citizens that cost metal”. More important is what mercenaries must be in 0 A.D.; perhaps their templates should get fully separated, as is the case with champions.
(Also keep in mind mercenaries are not supposed to be cost effective.)

My intention is that they are better soldiers than ordinary citizens, so i want them to start rank 2. My thought about mercenary is that it will be a quick training unit for ambushes, gaining in quantity / quality. Also good to defend in an emergency.

Why not do that then, perhaps in combination with a further reduction of their training time?

Nescio edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)Mar 16 2021, 5:47 PM
borg- added a comment.EditedMar 16 2021, 5:47 PM

Edit.

Yeah, see D3699; it's probably not perfect, yet it doesn't hurt to have more alternatives to choose from.

borg- added a comment.Mar 16 2021, 5:59 PM

Yeah, see D3699; it's probably not perfect, yet it doesn't hurt to have more alternatives to choose from.

Anyway D3699 is necessary for me, it was the final goal with the mercenaries, thanks for the patch.
I've already posted a comment there, I don't know if it's visible.

wraitii requested changes to this revision.Tue, Jun 1, 9:19 AM

D3699 was committed with some more changes and this needs a rebase anyways

This revision now requires changes to proceed.Tue, Jun 1, 9:19 AM