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[gameplay] differentiating athens: democracy
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Authored by borg- on Mar 23 2021, 3:37 AM.

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Summary

This is yet another patch to differentiate civilization from Athens.

Discussed in the forum https://wildfiregames.com/forum/topic/36934-civ-differentiation-athens/

In addition to bonuses, auras, etc ... we want to give Athens something peculiar of this culturally rich civilization. @chrstgtr raised a discussion in which I would like to see something involving Athenian democracy, which was a historic milestone for the world.

As democracy was born in athens, the idea is:

1- prytaneion moved to village phase.
2- phase up techs moved to prytaneion.
3- phase up search 50% faster. Town phase needs 4 village buildings + prytaneion. City phase needs 2 + prytaneion. D3686 decrease to 3, so it seems more reasonable to decrease to 2.
The idea here is to be able to advance from a faster phase with athens, making an analogy to faster growth and technological advance ahead of its time.
4- added prytaneion regen health aura just for heroes.
Prytaneion also served as accommodation for officers.

See also D3675, D3688, D3738.

Test Plan

Check that it is correct.
Is there a better way to do this?
Can make athen op?

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Event Timeline

borg- created this revision.Mar 23 2021, 3:37 AM
borg- requested review of this revision.Mar 23 2021, 3:37 AM
borg- edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
borg- added a subscriber: Nescio.Mar 23 2021, 3:58 AM
chrstgtr added a comment.EditedMar 23 2021, 4:40 AM

A couple considerations to consider for discussion:

  1. - There has been some discussion about whether we should reinstitute the health 20% health bonus associated with phasing up from p1 to p2. If the health bonus is reimplemented that could make a quick prytaneion build-->p2-->rush potentially very OP.
  2. Again, building a quick prytaneion and making Iphicrates could make for a very OP rush quick rush. If nothing else, a single hero may be able to very effectively rush a low pop player.
  3. This would enable a quick p3-->siege rush because a player could be sent stone/metal by allies to rush to p3 at a very low pop. This would be problematic because waves of siege can be very difficult to destroy, especially before proper defenses are built, and some civs do not have proper anti-siege siege units in p1 or early p2 (for example, ptol needs to become p2, build a colony, and produce swords from the colony before it can properly defend against rams).
  4. Making the p2 tech free will free up a lot of wood/food to produce units and boom more quickly
  5. Making the research time for p2 tech 0 will save up a lot of time from one of the main early unit production centers that will allow athens to boom more quickly

Given the considerations above, I think it may make sense to make it a little more difficult to go quickly to p2. Some possible ideas on how to do that are below.

  1. Require some additional buildings for athens to phase up to p2. I would think a requirement like "3 buildings and a prytaneion" would slow a quick p2 because this would require the player to generally make at least a farmstead, a storehouse, and a house.
  2. Increase the cost of the prytaneion, which can currently be built very cheaply (100s, 200m) and without much tradeoff in p1.

Given the considerations above, it may also make sense to offset some of the booming benefits Athens would get from the change. Some possible ways to do this are below.

  1. Increase the cost of the prytaneion
  2. Keep the p2 tech res costs and/or research time requirements.

Given the considerations above it may make some sense to institute some restrictions around producing heros too quickly. Some possible ways to do this below.

  1. Increase the cost of heros
  2. Prevent heros being made before some set time, building count, or population count

Overall, I think this is an interesting idea, but will require some testing to make sure that the proposal's current form will not make Athens too OP

Increase the cost of the prytaneion, which can currently be built very cheaply (100s, 200m) and without much tradeoff in p1.

Seems like the obvious solution. You'd make the Prytaneion cost as much resources and unit construction time as would be roughly analogous to the cost and civ center downtime for other civs to research Town phase traditionally. :)

How about phasing up form the Prytaneion? (And obviously the notes from above.)

How about phasing up form the Prytaneion? (And obviously the notes from above.)

Yes, i forgot it, thanks.

I think the solution to the point of @chrstgtr is to keep the current cost of 500 food 500 wood and 30 seconds, this should solve the problem or part of it.

borg- updated this revision to Diff 16691.Mar 24 2021, 1:01 AM
borg- edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)

Heroes moved to phase 3 again.
New Prytaneion aura.
Phase tech moved to prytaneion.
Phase up techs cost less resources and search faster.

borg- updated this revision to Diff 16692.Mar 24 2021, 1:09 AM
borg- updated this revision to Diff 16694.Mar 24 2021, 2:53 AM
borg- edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)

Removed the 20% discount on the cost of technologies. The patch proposed by @valirant D3675 should already give a reasonable discount.
Decreased the amount of construction for city phase from 3 to 2 + prytaneion. D3686 decrease to 3, so it seems more reasonable to decrease to two.

borg- updated this revision to Diff 16713.Mar 24 2021, 10:36 PM
borg- edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
borg- edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)Mar 24 2021, 11:14 PM

2- phase up techs moved to prytaneion.
3- phase up search 50% faster. Town phase needs 4 village buildings + prytaneion. City phase needs 2 + prytaneion. D3686 decrease to 3, so it seems more reasonable to decrease to 2.
The idea here is to be able to advance from a faster phase with athens, making an analogy to faster growth and technological advance ahead of its time.

I'm not a fan of this part.
For the rest, it's something I'd be down to try. Athens having the option to train heroes p2 isn't going to be as insane as other civs due to them not getting cavalry heros, but still could be a bit overwhelming for the enemy.

One could do a bit longer phasing up instead of quicker. Because people can easily keep producing economy now. (And one could argue that democratic politics warrant slow decisions ^^ )

borg- planned changes to this revision.Mar 26 2021, 2:39 PM