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Buff Siege Tower
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Authored by Hannibal_Barca on May 13 2017, 3:24 PM.

Details

Summary

Following the nerf of Siege Towers in a21 svn, they have been made useless again.
@Grugnas tested them numerous times and has long come to the conclusion that they are useless and should be changed.
This proposal makes Bolt-Shooters garrisonnable into Siege Towers for -20% attack but +5m range of the normal bolt-shooter.
It makes no sense that a bolt-shooter mounted on a high structure should have less range than if on the ground.
This explains the seemingly high range. The maximum number of projectiles is 3 and default is 0 (bolts are quite devastating)
To make up for all this its speed has been reduced from 6.5 to 4 with adjusted run, since it makes to sense that such a huge, lumbering war machine should travel at such a speed.

After testing them in various circumstances I have noted that while they are very strong vs citizens and not bad vs champion infantry, they do poorly vs cavalry, siege and elephants.
This is not surprising and is intended.

Test Plan

Test Siege Tower unit for usability, possible OPness and bugs.

Diff Detail

Repository
rP 0 A.D. Public Repository
Lint
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Unit
Unit Tests Skipped
Build Status
Buildable 1695
Build 2681: Vulcan BuildJenkins

Event Timeline

Hannibal_Barca created this revision.May 13 2017, 3:24 PM
Hannibal_Barca edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)May 13 2017, 3:29 PM
Hannibal_Barca edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
Vulcan added a subscriber: Vulcan.May 13 2017, 4:12 PM

Build is green

Updating workspaces.
Build (release)...
Build (debug)...
Running release tests...
Running cxxtest tests (306 tests)..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................OK!
Running debug tests...
Running cxxtest tests (306 tests)..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................OK!

http://jw:8080/job/phabricator/1182/ for more details.

Change default projectiles to 1 instead of 0. (so that you don't get an empty piece of wood after spending 500 wood and 300 metal)

Since Seleucids don't have bolt-shooters, make theirs use catapults and fire catapult shots. Made necessary changes (new template, attack actor etc)

fatherbushido edited edge metadata.EditedMay 14 2017, 1:16 PM

I am not seduced at all with that kind of -imo messy- things, even more in alpha. It would be time to fix those things when all the related script code will be fixed.

This isn't messy, just added a template that's all. Siege towers are so useless at the moment and this change is both realistic and fun.

Siege towers are so useless at the moment

Indeed I don't use them to wash my car.

Grugnas edited edge metadata.May 14 2017, 1:57 PM

I am not against buffing siege towers since they obviously need a tweak, but I think that having two different types of siege towers because a civ doesn't have a required siege to get it working is somehow confusing.
An average player would memorize what he can do with a siege and train it but he won't pay attention to the fact that a seleucid siege tower is different from other civs siege towers because seleucids can't train bolt shooters and he will have an odd surprise.
The time to get the siege tower working is way greater now due the fact that other sieges have to be trained and I am not sure if it is a counter balance or a malus.
Imho siege towers having a capture rate would be reasonable and indeed realistic.

elexis edited edge metadata.May 14 2017, 2:15 PM

Indeed I don't use them to wash my car.

:P Well that wasn't proposed. According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helepolis and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_siege_engines#Siege_tower, "It was possible to have many different devices on siege towers, such as artillery, draw bridges and rams". So it's not as far off historically

fix those things when all the related script code will be fixed.

Visible garrisoning and secondary attacks?

In D488#19889, @Grugnas wrote:

having two different types of siege towers ... is somehow confusing.

Agree, especially because they have the same model. It is also awkward that this one wouldnt shoot regular arrows for units garrisoned while the other one does

Can change names like (Catapult Siege Tower) and (Ballistae Siege Tower). Also they use not arrows but bolts, I just found current "arrow" models more fitting than the torpedo like "bolts".

Siege towers are so useless at the moment

Indeed I don't use them to wash my car.

You left out a ","
A thus-structured sentence is used when one is in accordance with a previous statement that refers to the exact same subject and is similarly structured.

Correction: "Indeed, I don't use them to wash my car."

fatherbushido added a comment.EditedMay 14 2017, 3:05 PM

You left out a ","
A thus-structured sentence is used when one is in accordance with a previous statement that refers to the exact same subject and is similarly structured.

Correction: "Indeed, I don't use them to wash my car."

Well, ...
If you want to troll, feel free to do that in the lobby.
Until that, don't tread on me, ok?

Build is green

Updating workspaces.
Build (release)...
Build (debug)...
Running release tests...
Running cxxtest tests (306 tests)..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................OK!
Running debug tests...
Running cxxtest tests (306 tests)..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................OK!

http://jw:8080/job/phabricator/1196/ for more details.

You were trolling with your comments too and now you get upset. Well all I can say is that although you are a nice guy you take things the wrong way and are inconsiderate towards other peoples' feelings.

fatherbushido added a comment.EditedMay 14 2017, 3:34 PM

You were trolling with your comments too and now you get upset. Well all I can say is that although you are a nice guy you take things the wrong way and are inconsiderate towards other peoples' feelings.

Didn't I show enough abnegation?

(That said, I don't want you to feel bad).

fatherbushido requested changes to this revision.May 16 2017, 6:39 PM
This revision now requires changes to proceed.May 16 2017, 6:39 PM
Hannibal_Barca abandoned this revision.Jun 13 2017, 7:32 AM