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[gameplay] deprecate stoas and stoa champions
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Authored by Nescio on Jul 5 2020, 12:03 PM.

Details

Summary

0 A.D.'s implementation of royal stoas and their mercenary champions is historically rather problematic, as has been pointed out numerous times on the forums. A quick selection (there are more):

This patch therefore makes makes some long overdue changes to 0 A.D.'s so-called ‘royal stoas’ :

  • Removed stoas from the athen and spart building lists (mace couldn't build it anyway). In the future they could get a different purpose and be reintroduced (ptol and sele need stoa actors too).
  • Removed the 10 population line of the stoa (belongs to house).
  • Removed the mercenary champions from the stoa production queue.
  • Removed the ConquestCritical class, since they can no longer train units.
  • Kept the merc_black_cloak.xml, merc_thorakites.xml, and merc_thureophoros.xml units but deleted their {civ}_* children. Like other mercenary champions (gladiators, legionaries, Samnites, Thebans, Thespians), they (i.e. merc_*) are used in specific scenarios.
  • Deleted the now obsolete Stoa gui loading screen tip.
Test Plan

Check for completeness and correctness.

Unit TestsFailed

TimeTest
0 msJenkins > cxxtest_debug.xml::[failed-to-read]
Failed to read test report file E:\Jenkins\workspace\vs2015-differential\cxxtest_debug.xml org.dom4j.DocumentException: Error on line 347 of document : Content is not allowed in trailing section. at org.dom4j.io.SAXReader.read(SAXReader.java:511)
0 msJenkins > TestAllocators::Debug Build & Tests / test_da
0 msJenkins > TestAllocators::Release Build & Tests / test_da
0 msJenkins > TestAllocators::test_da
0 msJenkins > TestAllocators::test_da
View Full Test Results (1 Failed · 1,699 Passed)

Event Timeline

Nescio created this revision.Jul 5 2020, 12:03 PM
Owners added subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.Jul 5 2020, 12:03 PM

Build failure - The Moirai have given mortals hearts that can endure.

Link to build: https://jenkins.wildfiregames.com/job/docker-differential/2587/display/redirect

Nescio edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)Jul 5 2020, 12:25 PM
Nescio updated this revision to Diff 12564.Jul 5 2020, 12:39 PM
Nescio edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
  • removed ConquestCritical from stoa

Build failure - The Moirai have given mortals hearts that can endure.

Link to build: https://jenkins.wildfiregames.com/job/docker-differential/2588/display/redirect

borg- added a subscriber: borg-.EditedJul 5 2020, 6:21 PM

I would keep thureophoros for athen and thorakites for sparta and cloak for mace.

One type unit per civ.

In D2863#122792, @borg- wrote:

I would keep thureophoros for athen and thorakites for sparta and cloak for mace.

One type unit per civ.

Hmm, I'm not sure this is justifiable. By the time Athens was using Thureophoroi they had been militarily neutered for years. Thorakites for Sparta has no historical justification either, unfortunately. Sparta has Skiritai swordsdudes, so that's good enough for ram countering. Athens has the Marine sword dude.

borg- added a comment.EditedJul 6 2020, 12:57 AM

Hmm, I'm not sure this is justifiable. By the time Athens was using Thureophoroi they had been militarily neutered for years. Thorakites for Sparta has no historical justification either, unfortunately. Sparta has Skiritai swordsdudes, so that's good enough for ram countering. Athens has the Marine sword dude.

If it doesn't make historical sense, then it's fair. I don't mention these units to me in relation to counter ram. only athenas and persian have a champion infantry javelin, removing the athens seems to me to bring less diversity. Historically have some heavy javelin pra some special that could be add to athen?

Can be good some look on "iphacrates aura".

All three stoa champions are historically problematic for athen and spart, as are all hall units for pers (D2742). I recommend simply disabling them. Future differentials can introduce new things for these civs, but that's beyond the scope of this patch.

borg- accepted this revision.EditedJul 9 2020, 1:33 AM

If it is historically wrong, then I don't think it should be maintained.
I think we can "complete" these units with some others that are not being used, and the artists can also make some others if necessary.

I accept the idea, but I'm not sure if patch is written correctly. I didn't get bugs but I'm not sure.

This revision is now accepted and ready to land.Jul 9 2020, 1:33 AM
badosu added a subscriber: badosu.Jul 10 2020, 11:48 AM

Introduced a mace champion swordsman, using the black cloak actor, trainable at fortress and (with technology) barracks. This gives mace a much needed counter vs rams (athen has marines and spart skiritai).

Very much needed, thanks! Even though I dislike it being trained on a fortress, while other civilizations can train anti-siege units from barracks or other buildings, it synergizes with the siege workshop so it's an improvement.

wraitii added a subscriber: wraitii.EditedJul 12 2020, 11:48 AM

@Nescio Could you split this in:

  • Give Macedonians a swordsman
  • The mercenary specialisation removal
  • The stoa changes

?

I think all changes are positive but I'd like to commit them incrementally, and it'll be easier to check they're complete.

The introduction of the Macedonian swordsmen could be split off into a separate patch, sure, but the other two points are intrinsically related and I don't really see how I could split them cleanly.

@wraitii: D2872, D2873, D2874.
Once those three are committed I'll update this patch. The actual changes are made here.

Nescio planned changes to this revision.Jul 14 2020, 10:16 AM
Nescio updated this revision to Diff 13204.Aug 15 2020, 7:34 PM
Nescio retitled this revision from [gameplay] deprecate stoa champions and clean up stoa templates to [gameplay] deprecate stoas and stoa champions.
Nescio edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
Nescio removed a reviewer: Restricted Owners Package.
Nescio removed subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.
  • rebased and updated, smaller patch, as requested by @wraitii
This revision is now accepted and ready to land.Aug 15 2020, 7:34 PM
Owners added subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.Aug 15 2020, 7:34 PM
Nescio added inline comments.Aug 15 2020, 7:35 PM
binaries/data/mods/public/simulation/ai/petra/config.js
92–93

Missed in D2742/rP23888.

Nescio removed a reviewer: Angen.Nov 19 2020, 11:18 AM
Nescio updated this revision to Diff 14053.Nov 19 2020, 11:54 AM
Nescio edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
Nescio removed subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.
  • rebased
Owners added subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.Nov 19 2020, 11:54 AM

Build failure - The Moirai have given mortals hearts that can endure.

Link to build: https://jenkins.wildfiregames.com/job/docker-differential/3655/display/redirect

Nescio updated this revision to Diff 14142.Nov 22 2020, 12:41 PM
Nescio edited the summary of this revision. (Show Details)
  • forgot obsolete stoa loading screen tip
Owners added subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.Nov 22 2020, 12:42 PM
Nescio removed subscribers: Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package, Restricted Owners Package.Nov 22 2020, 12:43 PM
borg- added a comment.Dec 14 2020, 5:37 PM

any more opinions?

borg- added a comment.Tue, Dec 22, 3:05 PM

got no opposition

borg- accepted this revision.Wed, Dec 30, 12:09 PM
Nescio closed this revision.Mon, Jan 4, 4:12 PM